Last weekend, author and broadcaster Tavis Smiley invited all four leading presidential candidates to New Orleans along with venerated members of the black cultural and political elite —Rev. Al Sharpton, Dr. Cornel West, Donna Brazille, and Representative Sheila Jackson Lee among them—to address the annual State of the Black Union Symposium.
That the Republican candidates Governor Mike Huckabee and Senator John McCain did not attend came as no surprise. More unexpected was the fact that Senator Obama, locked in a dead heat for the pivotal March 4 Texas and Ohio primaries, declined Smiley’s invitation, offering to send his wife, Michelle instead. Smiley publicly criticized the Senator’s decision and was lambasted by black folk across the country who derided Smiley for shortsightedness and egotism. Smiley, who’s usually on the sunny side of black popular opinion, reported that members of his family experienced harassment and even death threats. Such is the intensity of Obama-mania at this stage of the campaign.
Sen. Clinton, who has watched her lead in money, delegates, and polls dwindle with alarming rapidity as Obama racked up 11 consecutive primary victories—and whose presidential hopes hang precariously on her ability to secure victories in Texas and Ohio—was there. “More than Obama, Senator Clinton needs to address this crowd,” said Rev. Sharpton, “to explain some of the race-tinged language we’ve heard from people in her campaign that has polluted and polarized this race.”
Considering the conflama, the Morial Convention Center was a fitting location. Fresh coats of paint and pretty words are not enough to exorcise the heartbreaking history of Hurricane Katrina or the uneasy spirits left in her wake. The sanitized stench of betrayal, broken promises, and ceaseless finger-pointing are a palpable part of the history of this venue. It is not an easy place to fake the funk.
Greeted by a standing ovation, the embattled Senator from New York took the stage and offered these poignant words:
“This campaign has taken all of us into uncharted territory as a party, as a nation, and as individuals. And yes, I think we can be both proud and grateful that we are breaking barriers and changing history for the good. But uncharted territory means the way forward isn't always easy. The high stakes and historic nature of Senator Obama’s candidacy and mine have vested this campaign with an intensity and an excitement seldom seen in the political arena. And, as often happens, there have been some painful moments, too. Those of us who have fought together for decades, to right wrongs and break barriers, cannot allow differences in our choice of who should be elected to undermine our fundamental unity and determination to change the course of this country starting in November [applause] because we represent precious opportunity and urgent responsibility for our wounded nation.”
After her address, and a question and answer session with Smiley that was broadcast live on C-Span, Sen. Clinton and I sat down for this exclusive interview. What followed wasn’t only a frank admission of her weaknesses, but also a reiteration of her unique strengths.
VIBE: Senator Clinton, I remember meeting you briefly at your last Christmas party at the White House. As I went through the reception line, the one thing I remember about that evening was your ability to connect in a very short period of time. In that moment, I felt like if I were to run into you in the grocery store the next day you might actually know who I was [laughter from the Senator]. It’s an incredible quality. Do you feel like you’ve been able to make that connection during the campaign tour?
CLINTON: You know that’s a really interesting question. I think I am much better at connecting with people one-on-one in personal settings like that. The human connection that I feel when I meet somebody — when I look into their eyes, when we exchange a word — is very important to me. And I don’t know that I’m as good at that on TV. I really don’t think I am, to be honest with you. I think that I am a person who is very “other” directed, and feels like it is my calling in life to really help other people. I’m always looking for ways that I might be of help, so every encounter is meaningful to me. On a one-to-one basis, it’s who I am and it’s how I come across. I don’t know that I’m as good at that on television, to be real honest with you.
I have many friends in the media who have been in TV, music, video games, and movies that I think have contributed to a culture of misogyny and coarseness. And I've spoken out about it and I¹ve written about it. It is something I wish we could rein in.
CLINTON: Right, right.
VIBE: Were you surprised at all how much empathy and connection you receive from people when you talk about your past? The things you’ve overcome both politically and in your marriage? Has that been surprising?
CLINTON: It’s been a little surprising because it’s hard for me to talk about myself. It’s not something I was raised to do. I’m a more reserved person than that. And since so much of my external life has been public for the last 15 years, I sort of assume, ‘Well, everyone knows that, so I don’t need to talk about it.’ But I am struck at how open people are, if I can just get myself to talk about me. Because I am so other-directed, I kinda say, ‘Okay enough about me, let’s talk about you!” And so in this campaign, I’ve had to learn more how to do that.
VIBE: I travel and lecture all over the country about feminism and hip hop and how they intersect.
CLINTON: Wow, that’s quite a combination.
VIBE: One of the reasons this campaign is so fascinating, this moment where we could actually have a woman president is...Amazing. I meet young women from some of the finest universities in the United States who are actually quite conflicted about how smart they are, how intelligent they are, and how much opportunity they have.
CLINTON: I know.
VIBE: It ends up coming back to “If I get the PhD. Am I ever going to get —
CLINTON: The MRS.
VIBE: Exactly. What do you feel your candidacy represents for them?
CLINTON: I hope it puts to rest those concerns. Because I encounter them too — both in a very explicit way, and implicitly in this campaign. There has just been this undercurrent of women’s roles and women’s leadership and women’s choices. It’s feeling a little bit like back to the future, because when I was a young woman it was very explicit. I had friends who didn’t take certain courses because they thought they’d be viewed as unmarriageable. They didn’t go into professions. They didn’t go into business. We’ve gotten way beyond that, but for so many women it is still a conflict between your ambitions, your motivations, and your insecurities. The barriers may have fallen through passing laws, but the internal doubts haven’t yet been overcome. And I think breaking the hardest and highest glass ceiling would give so much courage to so many women. And women say that to me. They say, ‘I watch you and I watch what you go through and I know I can do it. I know I can make it.’ I think it would be a great signal for our sons and our daughters. Judge us on who we are as people. Make choices that will fulfill you. Look for ways you can fulfill who you are meant to be. And I hope that I can play some small role in that.
VIBE: As a woman, does it pose a conflict for you or how do you reconcile — because it’s a conflict for me as an African-American woman— to know that one of your strongest supporters is Bob Johnson, the founder of BET, which airs videos that are filled with negative images of women.
CLINTON: Hmm-hmmm.
VIBE: As the female candidate what does that bring up for you?
CLINTON: Well, I have been an outspoken critic of the media and I have many friends in the media who have been in TV, music, video games, and movies that I think have contributed to a culture of misogyny and coarseness. And I’ve spoken out about it and I’ve written about it. It is something I wish we could reign in. Friends of mine, like the late C. Delores Tucker and others, did have an impact. But we still live in this kind of celebrity, impulsive, instant gratification world. I think it does a lot of damage to young people and young women’s self-esteem. If you come from a strong family, and you get other messages, and people support you, you’ve got a pretty good chance of being able to navigate through it. You’re still going to be effective. But if you are vulnerable and you see those images that can be devastating to your identity and self-esteem. So I’ve been real outspoken and I’ve been criticized for taking on Hollywood and taking on this culture. And I intend to keep taking it on.
VIBE: In your speech, you talked about having first, second, and third chances for children. In the last ten years the rate of incarceration of women has increased exponentially. I don’t think the average person realizes that it’s not 50% or 100%, it’s like 750% in the last thirty years. There are a disproportionate number of African-American men and women who are going to be released from prison with felony convictions. What do we do about that group of people who are effectively disenfranchised when they come out?
CLINTON: Number one, we need to divert more people from the prison system. We have too many people in prison for non-violent drug offenses, which disproportionately impacts on the African-American community. That’s why I’ve been a strong advocate of eliminating the disparity between crack cocaine and powder cocaine [sentencing].
There may have been a reason for it 25 years ago but there isn’t any justification for it now. But it also means that in the prisons themselves, we’ve got to get back to the services that used to be there. They have mostly been eliminated — GED programs, college credit programs, drug and alcohol abuse programs — I mean, it is like a wasteland. We put too many people in there and then we basically forget about them. And then when people come out we need a system of second-chance programs. And we need to move to restore people’s rights. They need to feel like they’ve done whatever time they’re supposed to do and now they are back as a full participant. So we need a network of job-training programs, of housing programs, of civic engagement and education programs.
And there are some good examples around. The Fortune Society in New York does a really good job. Other places like Greyston Bakery in Yonkers, NY that hires ex-offenders and trains them. We can do this on a larger scale than what we’re doing now. And a lot of the job training programs we used to have in this country, which has been decimated, need to be brought back so we can, as I have argued, put people to work in green collar jobs. We should be training people; we should be doing that in the prisons. We should be giving people skills that are going to be part of the economy of the future.
VIBE: This is such an amazing moment in history. For the first time I have been really, really happy to have two candidates who are so immensely qualified. Is there a chance Senator Clinton, that if you win the nomination that you will have Barack Obama on your ticket?
CLINTON: Of course there is. Of course there is. Now neither of us will answer this question [definitively] because we don’t want to look presumptuous and premature. But it is more than fair to say that—of course there is.
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